Okay, every time i look at it and think about it in my mind it just becomes more and more out of place in the army. Does anyone else feel this or am i alone in this opinion?

GS

I have been saying that the whole time.

I'm half in half out. I do like the premise and I think that a magical war machine could have a place in the army, but I'm having doubts as to whether this one should. Now that I look back on it I can see that it's way too weak for it's cost and probably too complicated as well. It does need a re-think, but I believe there's still a place for some form of it in the list.

I was saying that from the start. I think. I need to read over the rules again. I just dont see angels tugging a magical War Machine in...

Maybe a book...

Hmm. Thats an idea. A really big book that shoots rays of light?

Maybe...

Could always settle with another monkey.

Personally i think if including a War Machine is a problem we should include a Magic item that lets a Character shoot like a bolt thrower or somthing...

GS

What a brilliant idea! Lets call it ancient thunder and make it cost 65 points and carry a PL 6 bound spell!

Ahem. On a more serious note, if fancy magical stuff isn't working, we could always make a modified stone thrower or something. Say it hurls balls of purifying flame or causes explosions in the ground. If that's not fancy enough, let it fire multiple times a turn, but increase the risk of misfiring with each shot, or anything similarly fancy.

Of course, on the flip side, the current Senalim is not much more complicated than the Anvil of Doom, and everyone's praising that thing (I happen to dislike it intensely, but that may just be because my regular opponent plays Dwarfs).

lol!

Hmm, i did have the idea of an Angelic Cannon back when making 1.0 but it never came to fruition... Maybe if i stuck a really big cow to it. No, dont be silly, a monkey... yeah....

Gs

What is it with you and monkeys? Were you that boy that fell into the Gorilla exhibit at the zoo?

Anyways, I really didn't care for this version of the Senalim, I much rather liked my version of the Abalim a lot better.

i kinda dont like the senalim that much 2 reasons

1. on my only battle with it i caused my loss.
2.woth it in the army my justifcation for other races never discovering us becomes harder (deamons in crystals so hard).

mabey an actual fighting unit that is good WS6

Yeah, but angels dont "need" WS6 as WS5 tends to murder you enemys, but its an idea though.

Actually, no its not, shut up GS stop encouraging them!!

Well, i think its worth a look at. We need playtesting.

DA, did it own absoloutly destroy everything or was it just cause of bad moves etc?

GS

i was using a crystal based army and one humnan wizard stoped every single spell that it casted, imho it is too much like the casket of souls and is too risky.

OT: GS you happen to be the one complaining about too much going back and changing things that are set in the list. As of right now the Senalim has been voted in to the list and it should stay there until we finish going through and revising the rest of the list.

On another note If we do go back and change it I would not mind a "cannon"-like item that makes flaming explosions come from out of the ground (rules like a cannon but fluffwise different).

The only war items that should used in what i call "the fight for the light" is bright brillant colours each colour representing a positive energy force eg- blue= divine light and a great effect would be the release of this weapon should be projected with music and rechargable with sunlight. guys these characters afterall have only good intent for all beings

Im rasing this Iron because it is a particular concern of mine, if others have particular concerns that they think could seriously effect the army i dont mind them being discussed, i just dont want any more revisions on "core" parts of the army (unless they really are screwed...)

GS

well what about some realy graceful but essentially normal stone thrower? that would be simpl,e could have fluff, and not req. any new rules. It could have magic resistance, or something instead that would presumably get over the problem.

Hehe, hurls balls of magic resistance?

Every unit that is hit gains Magic Resistance 2 lol!

Actually, that could, theoretically work?

Say you aim it at an area, scatter then any units within 6" gain MR 2 for the next turn?

GS

I could see that. There is still the problem of, llike DA said, being discovered in the fluff.

I don't like that idea, just seems kind of pointless and something nobody will take. Maybe something along the lines of D6 S4 hits with no armor save on a unit fired like a Stone Thrower with magical attacks? It could be hurling a holy shower of crystals onto the enemy. Use it similar to a Doom Diver, either hit or miss on the point, or we could use the template, whatever.

yea fluff is an issue, and to the new member we are not fighting for good we are fighting for law and the distruction of chaos for we are damons of law.

so in light of that stone thrower like item when unit is hit it looses all chaos like add one (i.e frenzy) would that work.

DA (the one fighting for us at H&A)

Going off of that, if we wanted a bit more anti-chaos, why not make it negate marks for a turn?

i hope that was as joke but it dodn't sound like one, so.....
NONONONONONONONONNONONONONONONONONONO!

the thrower has magic resistance, or all daemons who come near it have to take a initiative/leadership test or die, or its "rocks" do double damage on daemonic units.... But no, not "Hehe, hurls balls of magic resistance?" no, no. No. and so on.

Hak

Why not, it would be great for a laugh! :D :P

Okay, it was a joke, maybe not. Man, this could take some serious thought (pulls out whip).

(YES ITS TRUE 1500 POSTS, TAKE THAT BARAN AHAHAHA)

GS

Good point, baran hasnt posted here yet.
*pulls out cheese whips and gives everyone one.*
Is it bad that what I said having nothing to do with the topic took up more space?

On a related note, now that I think about it, although magic resistance could work, damage would be better.

ant unit hit by it cannot cast or provide PD/DD, also any unit hit loses frenzy

no anti marks because then it is good only vs chaos and then it would be over priced

I think we should stay away from damage because we're not supposed to have a lot of shooting and we're starting to get too much (Sons, Ancient Thunder, Starfall, Wings of Revenge, and the Uranon's Thunderbolt item). I still think the Senalim should be a combat enhancer/debuffer.

hmm. Heres a thought, lone Phoenix?

Rather than a character mount (or both?!)

That means no shooting, you get a beastie, and you fill the "hole" in our hearts for rare choices.

GS

how s about an entirely new monster? like, beastie, but pure light griffon or something? If R-G could do some concepts on a kinda mutant griffon/bird/pegasus/hippogryph/chicken etc that would be nice,,,,, pretty please?

i LOVE that idea GS we go with a beast rare also have it as a mount too like the eagle.

I am pretty sure that somebody already brought up the idea of the lone pheonix unit in the pheonix thread. I like the idea, but the rules would have to be slightly different so that it could act as a beast of war in a sense and less as a mount (a less tame pheonix of sorts). If we can get a good rules write up of something like that then we can possibly switch up that with the senalim.