A few questions concerning fluff, so when I get started on some new batches of the stuff I know what to do:

1) What fluff are we currently in the greatest need for? Stories of special characters (at that, we should probably think up some special characters sooner or later)? Stories of battles that took place? The Culture of the angelic beings? Synopsis of cities?

2) As long as I keep them in a fluff state, and do not start to name off particular angels, can I delve into some of the more interesting aspects of our darker brethren (I have good ideas)?

3) Would anyone mind if I made a "Cult of the Daemon Hunters" (Not actually a cult, but you get the idea)? I would see this as being an organization of the more "Wild" (Note: Dominions, Powers, Vengences) angels that basic go on a prolonged Wild hunt to scourge any taint of the Daemonic Presence. Just a cool little subsection to our population I'd like to include. Apollyon, of course, would be the head of these angels ;)

That's all I have for now, tell me where I can go to help out some more. Note however, that fluff is third on my list of things to do for you guys, after art and conversion pieces- I want a signifigant part in the hand that shapes our beings from the clay (or in this case, plastic, greenstuff, and metal :blink: )

http://s11.invisionfree.com/Seraphim/index.php?showtopic=824

http://s11.invisionfree.com/Seraphim/index.php?showtopic=781

This is all the "basic" angel fluff that has been written, most of the other stuff written WP either wants written out or changed.

GS

one SPC i have in mind and always will will be Cato (formerly Canti)

i think mentoning the Fallen would be ok unless WP just yells ageinst(SP?) it.

i think the Deamon huinters idea would be ok but dont take my word on it, also the special character Apollyon was killed by the one and only WP.

Apollyon was meant to be a massive angel which counted more or less as a monster- the list has changed enough that I can understand why Apollyon would be taken out.

Apollyon is the name of a daemon from Pilgrim's Progress. ;)

We're not going to have fluff references to the fallen, except for what we have. Almost the whole site has already agreed on that.
Cato will never be a special character, DA. You ripped him off from some anime show.
We need good unit fluff, but I've already got a lot of that done. Some stuff for the special characters (Seraphaal, Ashshaitan, Michael, etc) would be great, as would a final version of the angelic language stuff, and some story about a battle with Chaos.

??? Wait wait wait. When did the whole site agree to tone down the fluff mentions to the fallen?

I remember that we didnt want them rules wise, but i dont remember there being a vote on wiping out the fallen from the fluff at all.

GS

only the name WP. The rest was from my own imagination, i just went through differnt names Talbucut, Canti, and now Cato(latin for wise one).

we can say they exist still and play a role agenst that, but now that i've looked oveer it they will just be deamons immune to instability.

I think that they should be in the fluff because the fall one probably the greatest event in angelic history, and it should be mentioned. Just because we don't have them rules wise does not mean that they are out of the fluff.

-This is what WP said, this is what i am questioning. They should play a fairly major roll in the fluff because of the fall. This implies they wont.

GS

I say that they should play a role in the fluff while WP does not. I say we vote!

I say you guys need to stop waffling. OBVIOUSLY, there will be a lot about them in the fluff on the Fall. However, I'm certain we already agreed in one of the many other threads discussing this topic that there should be only that one small reference to the post-fall angels. Fluff about THE FALL is great. Fluff about post-fall fallen is fine, but probably shouldn't be in the book.

Why not? I think it gives a still active darker side to the angels who are plotting there downfall, and offers an explenation for us fighting mortal races (The surviving fallen still plot against us, we are hunting them etc)

And, to be honest, i dont remember everyone agreeing like this, and we are not waffling we are discussing a serious issue which you seem to have overlooked. A vote would probably be best.

GS

I agree with GS on this that we should have post fallen fluff, because they create a fear in our armies that daemons could never cause.

They can go though the crystal forest, they know about us and our cities, also they are all alive (daemons come back after death every 100-1000 years so fallen get the same rule). So some stories about them would be good co convey that fear and hatred.

does the cult even exist anymore?

p.s. WP I don’t want to hear from you "of cause DA wants fallen he’s obsessed" or anything of the sort. If you include that or anything like it I will ignore all your post relating to the topic because of your bias

I was agreeing with the others that we should have fluff on the fall but I did not realize that they were advocates of much post-fallen angel fluff. My own personal feeling is that there should be a big section on the fall in general, but on the subject of post fallen angels, I believe a few snippets here and there will be fine and post-fallen fluff should be fine.

No, seriously, you guys, you are waffling a hell of a lot. Dark Angels, the unit, are post-fall fallen. We voted to get rid of everything about them a long time ago. Now suddenly you want them back again?

DA, enough personal attacks. Direct a trolling comment at me again and there will be consequences. Me disagreeing with you doesn't give you the right to flame me. Thank you.

WP you said that we are Waffling, well i found the post and we never fully decided to even kill them from the list they just fell out, the voting was a tie so we can change all we want. :D
http://s11.invisionfree.com/Seraphim/index.php?showtopic=265

Personal attacks is what I don’t want to hear from you just like in the post in elms story

sounds like a personal attack agenst me (but hey that might be the terrorism is only agenst you, if not its freedom fighters working.) disregarding everything I say because of an age old thing that already died away.

at least one story regarding post-transgression fallen fluff

DA, that wasn't actually the poll that got rid of them, was it? I believe all 5 list creators unanimously voted them out (which we have the power to do, seeing as it's our job).

DA, listen to yourself. You're obsessed with Dark Angels. Read your posts, your name, your sig, and look at your av. It wasn't a personal attack, it was a statement. A true one. Now please, if you have any future problems with me, PM me. Another public post on this subject will result in a deletion and a warning. We don't need this sort of thing.

if i remembered correctly that decision was to remove the unit of Dark Ones from the list, nothing about fluff. but i just want one story dealing with how we (the angels) have found a way to permanently remove the fallen from the warp, because they come back like daemons every 100-1000 years

My general oppinion is that there should be a fairly lengthy (3-5 page) section of fluff on angelic history. I believe that a page or two of this should be devoted to the event off the fall and the eradication of almost all of the fallen ones. That is my belief in how they should be included in the fluff. I am against continuous mention of fall angels who survived and strongly suggest that the only mention of them should be in the one-two page history that only hints at some still being alive. And DA I have to agree with WP that you have been aiming many comments that are in some ways attacks at him recently, and I would also caution you on this.

And Iron, that's pratically what we have. I think we've got three pages of history, 3/4ths of one is on the Fall, and it ends with a hint that they still survive. That's what we agreed on a week ago, right?

That is what I agreed on when I agreed that they should be included in the fluff and that is about all. If that is what we have then I am fine with it.

Personally I think that we should hint that they are not a dieing force which proves no threat but instead a powerful hand of darkness that poses one of the biggest threats to the angelic race.

In short they should be the angel’s worst nightmares

DA we all agreed that after the fall there were few of them left to cause any harm to the angelic host for quite a while to come. If we go back much later and add a seperate list for fallen angels we will include in their fluff more about how the angels underestimated them, but until then I believe they should just be mentioned as being few and far between.

Hmmm, looks like this is calming down a bit, which is good. I would just like to start out by saying I wasn't trying to start a post war by mentioning the Dark Angels, but clearly they draw a lot of heated debate. So here is my take on it-

Units: No, no, and no. Everyone is on board for this, so I'm not even going to explain my point of view

Fluff: I'm quite frankly happy with them being included only in respects as part of a the tragedy that struck the angelic race, and caused a massive slow down, if not halt, in their rise as a power. That's what should be included in the OFFICIAL book we are making.

That being said, I see no reason why we can't at least post some fluff on the Dark Angels that is unofficial and won't be in the book. After all, it is assumed that GW knows more about what is going on in the warhammer world than the gamers do, and as the creators of the angels, I see no harm in us at least dabbling in the dark angels, to see what we can come up with. As long as we preface any post about dark angel fluff with some form of "Unofficial" stamp, no reason for everyone to throw a fit about it, right?... can't we all just get along?

In summary- Units: NO. Fluff: Officially the fall, unofficially, some brainstorming is allowed...

If eveyone is alright with the brainstorming, then I'll be willing to dabble in it a bit, and help to control the Dark Angel Fluff and whatnot.

I am fine with dabbling in fluff but I agree that everyone should know that it is highly unofficial and will almost 100% assured that it will not be in the book.

ok brainstorming for just a basic knowledge is fine, though I doubt angels would underestimate a angel fused with chaos with powers beyond any normal angel’s skill. The majority are stable greater daemons IMHO.

@FE we are making a separate Fallen list? When did this happen?

p.s. Fallen like Deamons and Angels come back after they die.

Rouge makes a very good point. There's an enourmous line between fanfic and Official Seraphim Seal-Of-Approval stamped army fluff. Write all the fanfic about Dark Angels or Fallen Angels you want, but don't assume it's going in the book.

I am with WP and to answer your question DA we decided earlier that when we eventually finished with the list we are working on now that if we could draw enough interest we might start work on an appendix list for fallen angels (only if there is enough interest).

Question is who is holding the seal?

:P

GS

The list creators, specifically those working on fluff (read: ME!). :P The site in general really, but mainly the list creators.

To my knowledge yes.