Well?
Should angels have mounts of some sort, or should they be purely infantry. I don't mind the idea of mounts that much, it's mostly the sort of mounts that have been suggested that get me.

I say yes: I wouldn't mind giving it a go and seeing what ideas I could come up with- maybe I could even find something that we could all agree on...

Crazier things have happened.

I'm going to vote yes, for now, but understand that I want something NEW, not Novas or Drakes. I think angels should have some unique, terrifying monster.

Fair enough- I'll look into some different styles.

EDIT: I'll do a bit of work on it tonight; for now I really gotta study for my exams

I think that, if we do have some sort of mosters, then they should be on their own, possibly with angels controlling them, but not ridden.

i say yes only if its a monster like creature something terrifying monster

if its a drake then no i see drakes now as like following their master side by side

Shooty certainly brings up a point worth considering. Whatever I come up with, I'll make sure it can serve more of a purpose than just a mount, in the event we decide we like it, but now at a mount.

I have seen old paintings where angles rode on the backs of unicors, pegusis & most often a mix of the 2.

However I don't think they should have mounts.

What sort of thing would we be looking for in a mount. Ive been looking through a lot of my older D&D books (and the new ones) which have A LOT of mythical beasts in them and i cant really seem to find somthing that suits an angel riding it.

I mean, a Dragon is probably ideal, it is big, it is scary, it is strong, it is a symbol of power, it can breathe fire. Any suggestion of what im looking for would help.

GS

Well, I was thinking something along the lines of a very feathered looking dragon, or a bird on steriods, if you will.

Other ideas included variations of Pegasi, griffons, Hipogriffs... maybe I'm going about this wrong, maybe I should try to make something a bit more Ethereal... we'll see what I go with...

OH, or a winged chariot (Kidding, I think...).

Yer know Chariot could work...

Hmm... (gets thinking...)

GS

Something like a terradon, but not made of matter in the normal sense. Something that merges with the angel to become like 1 singular entity, but still 2 distinct beings.
---Baran

I believe I have a few books on different kinds of dragons. I will try to come up with something that I think suits the angels. I will make sure that it can be something that can be a mount as well as a monster that can fight on its own in battle.

You're all thinking too much inside the box. You're focusing on material creatures. Whatever it is, it should be a being of Air and Fire (like the Angels themselves are).

And they should be able to fly, because I said so. They should also be more intelligent than other mounts, because they should be able to fight on their own.

Coatl? I can't remember how to spell it. Big snakes with feathery wings. Some sort of holy connotation, if I remember right. I think they even exist in WH, since my Lustria book mentions them once or twice.

While it's an idea, I dislike the idea of Angelic mounts. I think if you wanted a massive, scary flying thing with awesome stats, make a "Greater Angel" upgrade or something. I don't know. You'll all figure it out.

FLYING DOOM COWS????

Basically WP what you would like to see is an elemental...
hmm... i might have an idea

GS

I think I've got it. It really is a fire/air elemental, and people will know what it is. They are also supposedly very intelligent. A phoenix. It seems perfect for an angel to me, it'd be fun to draw or convert, and I think we could make some awsome rules. Hell, I'd use it.

Ooh! Phoenix! Nice. It would have to be different from pegasi though (rules wise) but not too out-there. I'll think of something for it.
---Baran

DAMN YOU WP!!!! I was about to post Phoenix!

Yep, that can work indeed. I might write up some rules later, its a great idea, unique in fantasy and can deifently have a cool conversion job.

Flying Doom Cows would be nice though... :D

GS

double damn WP! I was about to do the same as well <_<
It is somewhat fantastical, but it would look very cool. How would the Cherubim survive the flames though?

Trying to avoid too many special rules:



Phoenix
M4 WS4 BS0 S4 T4 A1 I6 W2 LD9

Special Rules
Wrapped in Flames: Any model in base to base takes a S3 hit. All attacks made by the phoenix also count as flaming.
Flight

---Baran

a phinox wpuld work well fly have flaming attacks, ignore the act that it would better belong with the TK

buti think that a phenix would work good, what kind of rules woud you give it?

I will write up some rules as well this weekend and we can all take a look at the different rules that people write up and merge them into a better idea. Or we could just vote on individual ones.

merging is the best option, alone it'll be ok but when we merge it it will be cool equal and strong

Senet+ Albliam

That was my thought process as well, I am thinking that when one rule set is created the rest of us will just post our rules in that thread and we can merge them in said thread until most people are happy with the rules.

sounds good lets do it

my rule
Loyalty in death: when the mount dies scater for it where ever it lans it will inflict S3 hits to all in the 3" template

Im sticking to a Cherubims mount version, stats should be seperate for that.

Heres my "off the top of my head" version.

Phoenix

M4 WS5 BS0 S5 T4 W3 I5 A3 Ld10

A Cherubim may ride a Phoenix (+180pts)

Special Rules
Flight, Terror, Flaming Attacks, Fire incarnate, Rebirth, Legendary Creature, Eternal Loyalty

Fire Incarnate
-A Phoenix has the ability to cast the following spell every turn.

Fireball- Bound Spell Power level 4

Legendary Creature
-The Phoenix has a 4+ ward save

Rebirth
-A Phoenix has the uncanny ability to become reborn in a new image, in this way they are immortal. Sometimes this process can be slow or fast, depending of the severity of the attack that destroyed it. When a Phoenix loses its last wound immediatly roll a single D6. On the roll of a 5+ the Phoenix regains a single wound (and so is not destroyed). This ability cannot be used against attacks S6 or higher.

Eternal Loyalty
-Phoenix's are incredibly loyal to there masters, as long as the Cherubim riding the Phoenix is alive they count as unbreakable.

I think it should be roughly equal in power to a hippogryph/wyvern/griffon, maybe a bit stronger. I'd up the points cost, give it 4, maybe 5 wounds/attacks. Keeping it T4 I would like as it makes it more interesting (it relies more on it's fiery ward save and rebirth rule to protect it rather than toughness or armour).

I like the rebirth rule as well, GS's one seems pretty good, but it's mutable. The important thing is to give it some form of rebirth ability (which is probably it's most famous characteristic).

I would also add Baran's wreathed in flames rule. If Sons of Fire have it, a Pheonix definately should. Putting it all together, maybe 250 points for the whole ensemble?

I like the idea of using a pheonix- if you all will give me the honor or sketching one out, I can start on it Tuesday (Exams until Tuesday).

Hurrah! I can't wait to see that. Out of interest, I'm curious as to whether you're going to draw the rider as well, since I can't really see how an Angel perched all the way up on the beast's back is going to fight. Maybe have the rider standing rather than sitting? Sort of like the 'surfer' look from the warhawk riders, but less corny (this is what I've done with my dragon rider, having him modelled leaping off the dragon's head, and it looks rather good).

I like the idea. I do not like the Fireball bound spell or the Eternal Loyalty rule. I think that at least that last rule makes the creature broken. Manticores for DE cost 190, and all they have is flight, terror, and scores of 5 across the stat line(except for W4, A4), and it's a Large Target. If you're going to keep the current lines, bump it up in points cost. A lot. What I would do is as follows (and yes, most of this was cut and pasted from GS's).

Phoenix

M5 WS5 BS0 S5 T4 W4 I5 A4 Ld8

A Cherubim may ride a Phoenix (+200pts)

Special Rules
Flight, Terror, Flaming Attacks, Fire Incarnate, Legendary Creature, Rebirth, Large Target

Fire Incarnate
- Immune to Fire

Legendary Creature
-The Phoenix has a 4+ ward save

Rebirth
-A Phoenix has the uncanny ability to become reborn in a new image, in this way they are immortal. Sometimes this process can be slow or fast, depending of the severity of the attack that destroyed it. When a Phoenix loses its last wound immediatly roll a single D6. On the roll of a 5+ the Phoenix regains a single wound (and so is not destroyed). This ability cannot be used against attacks S7 or higher.

Now, since people are averse to posting the base sizes of these models (which is infuriating), I'm making the assumption that it's a big, hurking monster like people wanted when we were debating the issue. If you want it as a smaller, Pegasus sized creature, reduce the stat line dramatically to something more like this.

Phoenix

M5 WS3 BS0 S4 T4 W3 I4 A3 Ld8

A Cherubim may ride a Phoenix (+75pts)

Special Rules
Flight, Flaming Attacks, Fire Incarnate, Legendary Creature, Rebirth

Fire Incarnate
- Immune to Fire

Legendary Creature
-The Phoenix has a 5+ ward save

Rebirth
-A Phoenix has the uncanny ability to become reborn in a new image, in this way they are immortal. Sometimes this process can be slow or fast, depending of the severity of the attack that destroyed it. When a Phoenix loses its last wound immediatly roll a single D6. On the roll of a 5+ the Phoenix regains a single wound (and so is not destroyed). This ability cannot be used against attacks S6 or higher.

Not sure yet. While I think it would look odd to have the angel perched on the creature's back, at the same time I think that we can stand to make the pheonix a bit smaller than the usual dragon or manticore, making it possible for the angel to fight from the pheonix. While we had spoken of a huge hulking monster, as Elm mentioned, I don't feel that we should make it ridiculous in size- The fact that this thing is wreathed in flames should be a good enough indication of it's power, and also will make a stunning centerpiece for the army. Additionally, we could give the angel the option to perhaps carry a spear or lance when mounted on the Pheonix, though I'm not sure on that one. Once I sketch the creature out I'll have better answers.

I should go ahead and mention, however, that I'm nog going to make this look like the very traditional pheonix, and may try a few varients that bring it closer to a very mystical looking griffon-esque creature (though my first version is going to make it appear to be bird like).

Make it the same on everyone. I think that we should go with it as a big moster mount, like a dragon or griffon, and so go with the first.

I was meant to include large target... And i dont even know where i got 180 from... :P

GS

Ok it looks ok to me but I will write up another version tonight and post it tomarrow after school. I was also thinking somwhere along the same lines as GS for a rebirth rule, but I may change it up a bit. And bring us that picture Rogue. Get to work!

i say Elm's first verson, a.k.a. GS's with a bit of alterations is good for a model to ride. well post if people want it or not, if not why.

Yeah, I liked the first one better as well, but since Large Target wasn't put in the original version, I put the second just in case it was on the smaller monster base.

Whatever GS, whatever Prince, I'm SURE you thought of that at the same time I did. ;)

We all seem to like it, so I don't really think we need a poll until we have a few prototypes. I'll throw my ideas into the mix here soonish.

Yeah I will too. As I wrote mine up topday I realized that I would not even vote for it in a poll, so I am rewriting it which will take me one more day or so (in German we are watching a movie so I think I will write my rules for it up then)