My friend and I have decided to test these guys out on the 'morrow maybe even the day after that. He will be playing Ogres, I will be playing Orcs.... I mean Angelic Beings Aka: Angels. This will be a 3000 point battle as my friend has vowed to never play a smaller game than this, for reasons unknown.

My list will consist (it ryhmes) of:

Lords:

Cherubim:200
Items: Eagle's Quill:25
Seraphaal's Tears: 35
Halberd
heavy armour
shield
Total: 275

Hereos:

Domion: 130
Items: Wings of Fire: 35
Waxing Glory:15
Halberd
heavy armour
shield
Total: 195

Virtue: 105
Items: Dispel x2
Total: 155


Dominion: 130
Items: Silvered Skin: 50
Halberd
heavy armour
shield
Total:195

Core:

15 Angels:11
Standard Bearer:12
Total: 152

15 Angels:11
Standard Bearer:12
Total: 152

20 Archangels: 14
Halberd
Standard Bearer:14
Total: 294

20 Archangels:14
Halberd
Standard Bearer:14
Total: 294

Special:

15 Cherubim Gaurds: 18
Standard Bearer:16
Divine Sentinel: 16
Total: 302

3 Powers: 62
Total: 186

3 Powers:
Total: 186

5 White Knights: 31
Total: 185

Rare:

8 Anelai: 17
Total: 166

8 Anelai: 17
Total: 166


Total: 2941
Model count: 130
DD: 3
PD: 3

Halos aren't really part of the list yet, but I guess a playtest with one won't hurt. I don't think that a Virtue may take Dispel Scrolls (in the same way that a demon can't). I'd like to see some Vengeances and Anelai, but other than that try it out and tell us how it does ASAP.

Ok. Angels in units of 25 aren't my cup o tea. I'd advise 3 units of 15 of each. I'd also try to get some more magic defense, but you don't necessarily need it. I don't know, but I think you need something that can really kill ogres. Vengeances maybe?

And Clavix, I told him to use scrolls, halos and WKs. He doesn't need scrolls against ogres, but I told him to include them.
---Baran

Old habits die hard... My Orc intution says get beefy units. Although, I thought this would do all right against them... The powers I'm sure will do something, plus I outnumber him basic 5 CR.

Well, we have found that Angels tend to work best at around 12, as this really helps out there manouverability.

Oh, and Clavix Daemons can take spell destroyer (or somthing like that) which is identical to a dispel scroll, we have to include dispel scrolls somewhere in the list...

Its the first time the Cherubim Guard will be tested, so that will be intresting as well as the white knights.

Only advise would be to split the angels up into units of 15, then get an extra unit of 10.

Reduce the Arch Angels to 20 in each unit ant use the pts to spend on some Alenai or somthing... You really need some disruption troops.

What do you think of it now?

Much better but i do still have a gripe. On closer inspection your Cherubim has Eagle Quills, although not a bad choice i suggest you have a character that will lead your troops from the front, so a Princedom (possibly a BSB) would be nice to keep your troops in order.

Either that or give the dominion the eagle quills.

To afford a princedom i would drop one Dominion, replace it with a princdeom, use the extra pts on a quire or somthing...

I think that the lack of magic will be a problem and so suggest using 35pts to give the Cherubim 1 level of magic, which will give you an extra dispel dice, and power dice to add to the pile.

Yes I know Demons have Spell Destroyer, but that may only be taken once and it is not a Dispel Scroll, so it is kinda different (which is why I moved for Halo of Banishment be put into the Arcane Blessings).

One question, why are there no full commands?

I usually don't spend anypoints on anything except for SB.

I'd advise a champion, as Ogre chars are real mean. Taking one out of combat can means the difference between winning by 2 or 3, and losing by 1 or 2.
---Baran

Really? Any special reason. I would never have a unit (other than fast cavalry or a sacrificial unit) without a command. Champions can accept challenges for your bigger characters and Musicians can break a tie in CR, so why would you not want to take one?

thats really odd no mater what anyone says i give all my DE units FC except DR just not worth it for a flanking unit but it is just a must for me and if i need to trim some points musican always goes first

how can you go with out a champion i can't imagen my wiches with out their hag *sees pure distruction in their corner of the battle from out number* like i said

Okay, for starters, get rid of all the halberds. Then, I'd suggest dropping one unit of Archangels for some Vengiances.
You will want commands.
Finally, I'd break some of the bigger units up, and go with combined charges. Seems like it would be more painful for the Ogres to me.
I can't wait to hear about it.

What's wrong with Halberds?

I assumed the halberds would be good as it adds that extra Strength that I'll need to wound.

Also I just never buy commands as I like to save the points, usually when I play I usually win by lots or lose by lots, I've never actually had a game where a muscian was needed. As for champion I don't think the extra attack is worth the points. It all comes down to me wanting more models on the board.

Yes, but we're not a horde army STOP THINKING O&G!!!! :P This is MSU. And a Champion has much more reasons to take than +1A. Be able to accept challenges for other characters and always get's to strike back unless targeted and killed. Champions are invaluable in MSU as are musicians, as if you tie (which is more likely with two MSU lists) you don't want to lose a combat because of a mere musician, might as well take it.

And I agree that Halberds are the better choice.

I never take Halberds. Even when the other option is just HW. They stink.

I disagree, Halberds are a very good choice IMO, especially against Ogres. Their high strength will probably disqualify our armor save (I think, little help GS?). And the strength bonus will probably be invaluable into dealing damage.

I always take halberds on my dark elven characters on foot, the extra strength bonus and the ability to still use your initiative (as opposed to a GW) is nice.

For angels, I prefer sword-sticks, for the flexibility.

i take halabards just for the fact that it gets you a +S in comabt its much better than just a hand weapon if tou pick between a halabard or GW halabard wins

Okay, when I get the energy, I'll do some math. :P I'm almost certain 2HW Arches will deal more damage to ogres than Halberders. Almost.

DA, it's halberd, not halabard. Halabard isn't even a word.

So today at 5 seraphim time I will be doing my playtest... :)